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Neinas says Big 12 set for 10 teams in 2012

Interim Big 12 Commissioner Chuck Neinas said Tuesday that the league is set with 10 teams for 2012 with the addition of TCU, even though Missouri is exploring a possible departure to the Southeastern Conference.

“If Missouri was going to change horses, it wouldn’t be for 2012 anyway,” Neinas said.

The Big 12 has given no deadline for a decision from Missouri, though Neinas said there would need to be some determination by the end of the current academic year. The school has not ruled out remaining part of the Big 12.

Neinas said the Big 12 needs to know what Missouri plans to do before the league can fully evaluate whether to stay at 10 members or expand back to 12.

“We can’t address the 10 vs. 12 until we determine that Missouri is going to be one of the 10,” he said. “There’s no consensus at the present time between the conference members as to 10 or 12.”

TCU accepted an invitation Monday to join the Big 12. The Horned Frogs will replace Texas A&M;, keeping the league at 10 members when the Aggies leave for the SEC next July.

While TCU will be the first new member since the Big 12 started play in 1996, Texas A&M; will be the third school to leave. Nebraska (Big Ten) and Colorado (Pac-12) left this year.

There were some indications after Big 12 athletic directors met last month that some might be in favor of staying at nine members. That has apparently changed.

“I don’t think anyone is holding that position now. I think the idea would be 10 or 12,” Neinas said, adding: “It won’t be 16.”

A 45-page document presented to Missouri curators earlier this month suggests the school would hope to get as much as $12 million more each year in additional revenue with a move to the SEC if TV deals are renegotiated. The document, which was obtained by the Associated Press, was shown to the curators after they gave Chancellor Brady Deaton authority to explore a departure from the Big 12.

Asked about the report and the financial projection, Neinas responded, “I don’t think that’s accurate.” Such projections would suggest the SEC would have to redo current deals and increase its annual TV income by $168 million based on a 14-team league, he said.

Big 12 leaders recently agreed to switch to equal revenue sharing after years in which the schools that made the most television appearances received the most money. The proposal, which would require schools to give their top TV rights to the Big 12 for six years, requires approval from the governing boards of Big 12 schools.

With equal sharing and a 13-year TV deal with Fox Sports worth more than $1 billion, Neinas indicated that the potential money per team could be similar in the Big 12 and SEC.

Comments

baldwinjhawk

To Quote a Mizwho fan on the Mrsec.com chat boards... " We don't win anything in the big 12 anyway so we might as well be in a great conference and not win.." quote unquote.. WOW! that pretty much sums up everything we need to know.

11 years, 1 month ago

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bradynsdad

To the Missouri fan that has been plaguing our site I have some numbers to show you. These are not bias numbers and feel free to share them with your university. Are these your leverage numbers? Since the inception of the big 12.

Missouri
Football national championships-0
Football major bowl championships-0
Football regular season conference champions-0
Football big 12 championship game wins-0
Basketball national championships-0
Basketball regular season championships-0
Basketball big 12 tournament championships-1

Not sure what your offering any other conference.

11 years, 1 month ago

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gchawk

What year did they win the Big 12 tournament? My mind is blanking that out, selective memory I guess.

11 years, 1 month ago

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AlecRaenos

It was that year Scott Drew threw out that zone in the Big 12 tourney at us and we hadn't seen them play zone all year and were unprepared for it and they sucker punched us in the first round.

That's how Mizzou won the title.

11 years, 1 month ago

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gchawk

And what year was that?

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

2009.

11 years, 1 month ago

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gchawk

Thanks

11 years, 1 month ago

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Yosemite

It's the six million people living in the state that's the attraction. Also they have AAU status which is a nice plus. How well their teams compete doesn't even matter.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Ryan Sullivan

I think atheletic performance does have something to do with conference realignment - that's why football is the driving force because the good teams generate lots of money.

Mizzery is pathetic. I could care less about our "rivalry" at this point. They can go to the SEC and get slaughtered week in and week out, or to any other conference they want. Oh wait, I guess another conference actually has to want them first. Clowns.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Yosemite

Like KU gets slaughtered week in and week out in the Big 12?

11 years, 1 month ago

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BewareOfThePhogOnTheWater

Most of that six million population do not support Mizery or are not MizWho fans. Even though they don't want to accept it, there are other universities in that state, in addition to the large KU and Illinois fan base. Kansas City, in particular, is more KU than mu. St. Louis also has a sizable KU fan base. They can't even sell out the Arena formerly known as the Paige unless they play us.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Yosemite

They will have more than 70,000 fans at their homecoming this Saturday. KU didn't even have 40,000. And there aren't any other BCS schools in Missouri, so they are the singular focus in the whole state. Missouri has fans living in Kansas and Illinois, too.

11 years, 1 month ago

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nuleafjhawk

My favorite T-shirt:

Missouri - 6 million people, 5 last names

11 years, 1 month ago

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sevenyearhawk

I started that chant during the ESPN College GameDay broadcast of the Border War at Arrowhead ...

too bad I won't see anything like that again with Turner here. :(

11 years, 1 month ago

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nuleafjhawk

Well, congratulations! It's hilarious.

11 years, 1 month ago

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bradynsdad

Yosemite are you implying that mizzou has 6 million followers? It's not that Missouri isn't trying to do what's best for them but think about this, you just made the joke that mizzou will get kicked around like ku. Do you believe that if you guys can't win a conference title in football here that you will have a better chance of winning one in the sec? I think you would be more competitive in basketball but regardless what you believe you would end up being the ku of football in the sec.

11 years, 1 month ago

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CloveK

They will more than likely lose a lot of Texas recruits as well. Just look at Arkansas. They went from averaging 40 a year to 10 when the SWC fell apart and they went to the SEC.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Shawn Baker

Well they own the St Louis, and Kansas City tv markets.

11 years, 1 month ago

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TwistedFish31

It's funny that the mizzourah fans keep saying that they own the KC market. mizzourah doesn't have a basketball game in KC every year, KU does. The Ozark inbreds do travel to KC for the game at Arrowhead because that's their one big trip to a city each year. I don't think they even have the St Louis market. That share that with Illinois. Keep making stuff up mizzou, maybe C-USA will buy what you're selling. In the meantime, the Big XII should just tell them to leave already and go after a school that will actually bring something to the conference...like a National Title in something, or maybe a single Final Four. Oh wait, this is about football. Okay, or maybe even one BCS Bowl game.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Alan Braun

They do NOT own the Kansas City market. It probably splits 40-30-30 between KU, MU and KSU respectively. There are definitely more KU than MU fans in the KC area, among people who pay attention to college sports at all. As in most places, a lot of the TV market is pro sports fans who don't give a rip about college sports at all.

11 years, 1 month ago

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TKHAWK

Good for now, but I hope they don't stop there. I'd like to see the BigXII get back to 12 schools, both for the conference championship game and return of a North and South division. KU's only realistic hope for the future would be to return to some form of Northern Division with 4 non-con games and not having to play OU, OSU, TT, UT, and now TCU every year. Sad to say, but it sounds better to say we finished second in the Northern division, even if that turns out to be 6th or 7th out of 12. I know the Orange Bowl year was awesome, but the way its set up now, you take that same Orange Bowl team, drop one of the non-con games replaced by TCU and add in Texas and Oklahoma replacing Nebraska and Colorado, that wouldn't have been quite the dream season that it was. We'd have been in a bowl, but not the Orange Bowl. I don't care who our coach is, KU will struggle yearly with our current football schedule. But at least KSU and MU will struggle as well, so I guess missery loves company.

11 years, 1 month ago

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iluvdbskxjayhawks

I want us to get back to 12 teams. I want a championship game. ESPN or Fox, shell out more money please! To be stable let's get 12. 10 is too iffy. One team leaves like mizzou and it starts falling apart again. Can misery hurry up and make up their mind? why r they taking so long? Geezus!

11 years, 1 month ago

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nuleafjhawk

Just out of curiosity, why do you want a championship game? I always thought it was a good way to get someone injured just before a big bowl game, and the Big 12 has enough trouble winning big bowl games anyway. I'm not trying to be argumentative - just curious. Thanks!

11 years, 1 month ago

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Matt Gauntt

I know football rules, but I would love to see us get Louisville, Cincy and West Virginia. Think of the basketball matchups. I know that leaves us at 13......for now, provided Mizzery stays. Of the three, Cincy would be the weakest.

If we get to 13 and have those schools joining us, it would be clear that we are a league that is staying put. It would make us a lot more attractive to schools that might think of splitting their conference.

11 years, 1 month ago

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trey

Huge mistake for the Big12 if they stick with 10 teams. That would allow the Big East to solidify, and again make the Big12 the "hunted" vs the "hunter".

I hope what Chuck is saying is this...

Even if MU goes to the SEC, they can't/won't leave next year because the buyout is too great ($25M). Though don't know why A&M can pay up?
Even if the Big12 adds Louisville and W Vga, they can't play next year (Big East required 27month notice).
So we'll play 10 game schedule next year, with TCU subbing for A&M.

But expand to 12 for the following year by...

Adding BYU, Louisville, and W. Vga (while losing MU).

The Big12 has to kill the Big East to survive long-term. Come on Chuck, think...

11 years, 1 month ago

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Daniel Kennamore

"Though don't know why A&M can pay up?"

A&M's fan-base is rabid about their football, and their pocket are MUCH deeper than Mizzou's. They likely have two or three of their richer alumns offering to write a check to cover the buyout.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Williams

oil money

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

10 teams in 2012 makes perfect sense given the most often mentioned "most likely" candidates to expand to 12, i.e., Louisville and West Virginia. Barring negotiating earlier outs with the Big East, they would not be joining the B12 earlier than the 2014 season.

But waiting for Moo to make a decision is the wrong strategy. Move to get the last two members now so the plan to stability and prosperity is executed as soon as possible. Then move to replace Moo if they get enough SEC votes to enable them to leave.

"A good plan violently executed now is better than a perfect plan executed next week." -- George S. Patton, Jr.

11 years, 1 month ago

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d_park

Two words : Mario Kinsey

11 years, 1 month ago

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iluvdbskxjayhawks

http://www.kansascity.com/2011/10/11/...

I guess Missouri wanted a minimum commitment of 10 years while Texas only wants 6 years. Maybe this is the reason Mizzou is flirting with SEC. Maybe they are worried that Texas and OU are going to leave again in 6 years. Maybe it's good for them to bail out now before realignment pops back up again. I do agree with Mizzou. The longer the commitment is, the more stable the conference is. 10 years sound better than 6 years.

11 years, 1 month ago

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jgkojak

A few observations:
1) MU has little to worry about. If TX and OK leave in 6 years, it will be to join 16-team conferences... and MU will obviously have a place in either the SEC or even the B10 if that happens.

2) Interesting they are sticking w/10 until they know what MU does. That indicates that if they invite teams from the Big East, they want to do it once - if MU stays, BYU and Louisville. If MU goes, they will need another Big East team.

3) If we do have a couple Big East teams in proximity, what are the chances we snag Notre Dame's non-football sports? Bring in DePaul as a travel partner for non-football (Chicago market)?

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

Web chatter and news media reports are that B12 talks with BYU are ongoing but practically at an impasse. Conversely, it seems that both WVU and UL, both programs that are apparently on the B12's "interest" list, are lobbying the B12 Expansion committee hard to join so they can escape the BEast.

I have read nothing -- except net talk by folks like you and me, of course -- about the B12 having any interest at all in "partial" members beyond Notre Dame, and even with ND all they really want is FB. The rest of ND's sports are simply not that big a draw, not even their hoops. Just IMO, but I don't see anyone being accepted by the Big 12 that isn't willing to be in the conference all the way, even ND. The BIg East provides an excellent example of the problems of dealing with such an arrangement.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Robert Brown

First off, I believe we need to get back to 12 teams. To LTC's point, if the plan is to pick a team or two from the Big East, that can be done in the interim with the intention of the these teams joining the league in 2014 to comply with Big East bylaws.

Regarding the statement about Missouri being in the league in 2012. I wonder if this is a signal to MU that the conference will not let them leave early if they chose to go to the SEC. It could also be a signal that league will expect them to pay their entire exit fee which could be around $25M..

My understanding is that NU and CU were able to negotiate a settlement that allowed them to leave earlier and as a result they paid less of an exit fee. I think the conference decided it made sense for scheduling purposes. The Big 12 may not be in such a negotiating mood if MU decides to leave.

11 years, 1 month ago

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milwaukeeJAYHAWK

Why not get aggressive and just go for two more teams right now? Must be UT and OU not wanting a Big 12 Championship game, otherwise we really need to get back to 12.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

Check this out -- but please, please don't believe it! Just laugh along with the writer.
http://memphis-news.info/memphis-top-...

11 years, 1 month ago

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Spencer Goff

Nice. Made my day sir, made my day.

11 years, 1 month ago

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AndOne

11 years, 1 month ago

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texashawk10

SDSU has good basketball and would give the Big 12 a small foothold in SoCal for recruiting in football and basketball. SDSU wouldn't be at the top of my list for expansion, but the Big 12 could also do a lot worse than a SoCal school with good basketball and better football than KU or ISU.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Lonnie Ross Dillon

As I'm Living in Vegas that would be awesome, only 5 hr drive to see KU play. Better yet, without having to join the PAC-whatever or the Mountain West.

11 years, 1 month ago

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blindrabbit

Chicago: Cincy and Louisville are typical big city thuggish teams; West Virginia is a Eastern school with a very poor academic standing with a campus full of typical West Virginians (if you get what I mean). Go for 12; kick Mzzou out if that's what they want, no real loss. Add either 2 or 3 teams to complete the 12, by adding teams from the following: Houston, BYU, Boise, New Mexico, SMU, Colorado State or Tulsa. Can't figure out the love affair with West Virginia; visit sometime to change your mind!

11 years, 1 month ago

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iluvdbskxjayhawks

i don't think west virginia is a good idea. sure they can join us but they will leave when SEC and ACC decides to expand. They are too far out there.

11 years, 1 month ago

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iluvdbskxjayhawks

did big 12 really invite air force? it's kinda embarrassing that they rather go to big east than us. not many people are reporting it.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

Not embarrassing at all. AFA AD specifically said the Falcons could not be competitive in the Big 12, and the AFA could not do that to it's athletes.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Benjamin Piehler

*cough*missouri-sec*cough*

11 years, 1 month ago

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Gary Wirsig

There is (or was) a plan for Army, Navy and AF to all go to the Big East. The association with the other service academies is the reason it's attractive to the AF.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

AFA is interested for FB only. USNA is saying "we're interested, but your ship is leaking a bit too much as yet for us to come aboard". USMA apparently has been listening to Citadel grads for too long (Citadel folks call West Point "Hudson High"), having to be convinced by AFA and USNA that the Cadets *can* compete against BEast level competition, and the 3 service schools should band together there for FB for the future. Haven't seen any new USMA manuevering on that front since its declaring last week they can't play at that level. A rather sad statement coming from one of the original college football powers.

11 years, 1 month ago

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blindrabbit

Air Force and Navy seem to be competitive in major sports but you don't hear much about Army. Is this because it is more of an Eastern School or does not emphasize major sports? Just curious!

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

All three major service academies emphasize NCAA sports, but they all have significant restrictions that other institutions don't. Start with nomination by U.S. Congressman, Senator or VPOTUS (not as big a hurdle as that might seem), throw in must be 17-23 upon enrollment, no JUCO transfers (*everyone* must do 4 years, starting as a freshman), must be unmarried and have no child support obligations, and you can see why a lot of otherwise quality athletes today can't get in.

Add in that all the service academies are *highly* selective (11%-15% acceptance rate), and rank very high in academic ratings. For example, in 2009, West Point was named the best college in America by Forbes Magazine.
http://www.forbes.com/2009/08/02/coll...

And unfortunately for The Thin Gray Line, AF and Navy are "sexier" services than Army. Those sister services are generally considered to treat their people and their families better, and to provide better transitions from military to civilian careers across a broader spectrum of job skills. Since all cadets are expected to complete an active duty service obligation (usually 5 years) after graduating, those factors are very important considerations when looking at attending one of the service academies.

Throw in the height and weight requirements on top of everything else (yes, weight allowances are made for highly muscular cadets, but Body Fat measurements mean you won't see any really huge linemen), and you can see why the service academies don't do better than they do in FB and hoops (FTR, David Robinson was 6-7 his senior year in HS, and grew to 7' by the time he was a senior at Annapolis). And since AFA and USNA are generally more attractive to prospective student-athletes, they tend to get more than their share of the qualified athletes that can compete at the major college level than Army does.

Just the way it is.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

This LJW "article" leaves out an important bit of info Neinas mentioned -- that the B12 is willing to give Moo until the end of the academic year to decide what it wants to do!!
http://brett-mcmurphy.blogs.cbssports...

They bloody well better not wait on Moo for anything if that is the case. Move now and do not give the BEast -- which *is* acting to expand now to help it keep its members from jumping -- a chance to convince UL and WVU or anyone else the B12 may want to target to stay.

11 years, 1 month ago

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TKHAWK

Its refreshing after the turmoil the big 12 has been through, check out this article out of Louisville expressing their concern for the future of the big east, and the helpless feeling of waiting to see what MU does so that they might get a big 12 bid. Sound like KU about a month ago?

http://louisvillesportslive.net/tcu-w...

11 years, 1 month ago

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blindrabbit

MU defecate or get off the pot!

11 years, 1 month ago

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trey

Maybe Chuck is saying to MU....

"Read between the lines", you leave next year and it's $25M.

And if so, we play with 9 teams next year.
And add BYU, Louisville and W Vga for following year.

11 years, 1 month ago

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MWShields

If anyone is interested in having a little fun at the expense of the MU board of curators and Chancellor Deaton their email addresses are below. I emailed them and complained about the play of James Franklin and asked them to apply pressure to Pinkel to play Berkstresser. I figure since they want to make decisions about conference realignment they might as well field concerns about other things as well. Before anyone jumps all over me, I'm a Jayhawk and just wanted to have a little fun at their expense.

deatonb@missouri.edu; owenssj@umsystem.edu; boardofcurators@umsystem.edu; werdman@kcsouthern.com; davidb@newspressnow.com; ddowning@grgpc.com; don@elliscuppsandcole.com; jhaggard@semohealthnetwork.org; david.steward@wwt.com; craig@vanmatre.com

11 years, 1 month ago

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Brian Skelly

It still bothers me that the Big 12 folks seem okay with 10. It doesnt take great foresight to see this simply could be a waiting game and stall tactics -- on all sides here. Wait for other shoes to drop so no one is "the bad guy".

12 is the minimum to make this thing work. And id even be okay if Mizzou comes back, and huffs and puffs and says "We'll do this if we have a 10 year commitment" -- which I think all of us Jayhawks agree would help. The idea we can stay at 10 is insane, and it's clear there isnt agreement on this issue amongst the folks.

UT is openly for the 10 (hey, they wanted 9). OU is openly wanting 12. An OSU head cheese has said stay at 10. KSU wants 12. Have not seen others opinions, including anyone from KU.

Its tough for me to see any of the 'north' schools (Mizzou included) that wouldnt want to go back to a divisional format. And if OU wants it as well, it would seem that going the route of 12 would have a majority.

Throughout this ive warmed up to the point that inviting Louisville seems like a total no brainer. Im less passionate about any of the other ideas thrown around (another Texas school, WV, BYU, USF, etc. I get that the "pie" is split more ways with 12, but I appreciate Boren's comments that this should be about stability, not revenues. Of course the two are clearly intertwined here, arent they?

Im still indifferent about Mizzou. I'd prefer they stay, but they're soooooo schizo, I wouldnt miss that part of them. It would hurt KC for sure, which has to play into the decision weather its said so publicly or not.

The 'waiting for mizzou' part strikes me more as 'waiting for the SEC' really. My guess is the SEC is more interested FSU than Mizzou or WV or Clemson. Of course, that could be a harder get.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

I keep reading on msg boards (mimimal credibility) that the SEC is looking at FSU and Clemson. But I've yet to come across any media reporting -- which usually have real sources and not just uninformed wish lists -- stating anything but FSU and Clemson are both extremely happy to be ACC. And everyone seems to forget that the FSU president is on record that FSU is happy with the ACC, and both FSU and Clemson cast "yes" votes to raise the ACC exit fees to $20M.

That's not saying the SEC wouldn't talk with FSU and Clemson, but both would be extremely hard gets since the ACC has positioned itself quite well for the future, even better if they decide to bring in UConn and Rutgers from the BEast. The ACC would dominate the entire length of the east coast and its major media markets. Plus both programs have a better chance of reaching BCS bowl games in the ACC than they do in the SEC.

What I've been able to discern so far is that there is still a substantial bloc in the SEC that feels that bringing in Moo would be "settling" for the SEC. That said, given everything else above, who could they bring in that would be better for them than Moo? I like USF myself (for the media market, program growth and division alignments letting Bama keep its games with Tennessee and Auburn) once FSU and Clemson turn the SEC down again. After them, I can see the SEC settling for WVU (whom rumor has it already applied last month and was turned down, hence their interest in the B12) only if Moo decides that, in addition to everything else, political and economic pressures from KC and western MO are the final straw making it better for them to stay in the Big 12.

11 years, 1 month ago

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MWShields

I think the thought is to sit at 10 for 2012 and get back to 12 in 2013. Any Big East team is going to have to stay in Big East for at least the 2012 season. The SEC isn't going to swoop in and take either one of those and I keep hearing ND is considering placing non-football sports in the B12. I'm okay with sitting tight for one year to make sure we get the best possible schools to join as opposed to rushing in and grabbing just anyone that's available. South Florida makes zero sense at all and that would be a huge mistake if they added them. If MU leaves and they add 3 schools the B12 would be better served adding L'ville, WVU, and Tulane. Tulane adds the NO market and is a top 50 ranked school nationally as well as an AAU school.

11 years, 1 month ago

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142466

That's OK that the new entrants wouldn't play until 2013. But the league ought to try to sign-up the strongest candidates now before they get away. These things are hindering: Mizzou's limbo status, lack of agreement among the members on getting back to 12, OU's and UT's failure to make credible public statements of long-term commitment to the B12.

Let's hope the league can clear these obstacles soon and get back to 12. If there are going to be long delays, I'm not confident long-term.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Eric Dawson

A misunderstanding? I was writing about the SEC looking at USF, not the B12. Also, who is saying ND wants to move its non-fb sports to the B12? I have not seen/heard anyone citing sources leaking this, do you have links? Thanks!

11 years, 1 month ago

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texashawk10

Some of you people are making me embarrassed to be a Jayhawk alum and fan. What's one thing we always have fun with about Missouri fans? Giving them hell for taking more pride in a KU loss in any sport than an MU win in any sport. And now I'm reading all this crap about people saying good riddance to Missouri and they'll enjoy seeing MU lose every week in the SEC and not caring about the Border War ending. When the hell the Kansas Jayhawk fans start mimicking some of the worst traits of Missouri fans, you people doing this are a total disgrace to Jayhawk nation. I enjoy a Missouri loss as much as anyone, at least I thought I did, but I will always take more pleasure and pride in a KU win in any sport than an MU loss in any sport because I am a Kansas Jayhawk fan, not an anti-MU fan like a lot of people here have apparently become.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Rock_Chalk_NYC

Good call CHUCK... Yeah, why should the Little 12 strengthen itself by actively seeking to acquire 2 top notch schools. Nope, Texas doesn't want to... so lets just remain the vulnerable Little 12 and wait for the next round of picking to come our way...

Sure sounds a lot like the Beebe years...

I hope I'm wrong, but sadly doubt I am.

KU football, ya have 6 years to get better. Sadly, Its all about football.

11 years, 1 month ago

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Sean O'Grady

How much does Mizzou stand to lose if they bolt and the Border War is interrupted and there's no longer a yearly game at Arrowhead?

I'm just curious how much of the extra millions will be offset by losing that game, and added travel expenses for the Olympic Sports. Not to mention reduced operating revenues from bowl games should (and they will for the first few years at least) become a middle of the pack SEC team.

When all the numbers are said and done, if you're only gaining a few mil net, what's the use?

Also, would someone consider the Antlers... who will they harass and what will be their new purpose in life? I can just see them standing on a street corner in Columbia, tattered yellow shirt with a sign that says "Will throw batteries at you for food."

11 years, 1 month ago

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